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Letters & Polemics (CSEL) 22 part 4/4

Latin original · 22 verses · some words can be tapped for a gloss · long chapter, split into parts; this part covers 22:114–22:135 (135 verses in all)

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22:114

Sed et qui polluitur et qui tenetur, liberatur; et nos si polluti sumus, mundamur. AUG. dixit: Sed hoc de dei natura non recte dicitur. sed de illa, quae pollui potest, recte dicitur, quia polluitur et mundatur; de illa uero, quae pollui non potest, uides cum quanto sacrilegio dicatur polluitur et mundatur\', maxime quia sic dicitis quandam dei partem esse pollutam, ut propterea ligetur in aeternum globo tenebrarum, quia non potuit mundari. hoc qui non anathemat, falsum paulo ante respondit, quia omnis, qui dicit corruptibilem deum, anathemandus est. FEL. dixit: Hoc, quod dixit sanctitas tua, quia pars, quae se non mundauit ab coinquinatione gentis tenebrarum .

But both he who is defiled and he who is held is set free; and we too, if we are defiled, are cleansed. AUGUSTINE said: But this is not rightly said of the nature of God. Of that which can be defiled, it is rightly said that it is defiled and cleansed; but of that which cannot be defiled, you see with how great a sacrilege it is said that it is defiled and cleansed — especially because you say in this way that a certain portion of God is defiled, so that on that account it is bound forever in the mass of darkness, because it could not be cleansed. Whoever does not anathematize this answered falsely a little while ago, that everyone who says God is corruptible is to be anathematized. FELIX said: This which your Holiness said, that the portion which did not cleanse itself from the contamination of the race of darkness…

但那被玷污的和那被拘的，都得釋放；我們若被玷污，也得潔淨。奧古斯丁說：但這話用在神的本性上是不對的。用在那能被玷污的東西上，說它被玷污又被潔淨，是對的；但用在那不能被玷污的東西上，你看看以何等重大的褻瀆說它被玷污又被潔淨——尤其因為你如此說神的某一部分被玷污，以致因此永遠被捆綁在黑暗的團塊中，因為它無法被潔淨。凡不咒詛這事的人，方才就答錯了，因他說凡說神可朽壞的人都該被咒詛。費利克斯說：你的聖德所說的這話，就是那沒有洗淨自己脫離黑暗族類污穢的那一部分……

22:115

et sic dicit Manichaeus, quia non sunt missi in regnum dei. hoc enim adseris tu, quia damnati sunt; sed Manichaeus hoc dicit, quia non damnati sunt, sed ad custodiam positi sunt illius gentis tenebrarum. - AUG. dixit: De ista parte tecum ago, quam dicis pollutam purgari: postea, si opus fuerit, de illa, quae figitur in globo eius. interim quae purgatur, polluta erat. FEL. dixit: Quae polluitur, et mundatur. AUG. dixit: Qui ergo dicit naturam dei et substantiam dei et id quod deus est, posse pollui, ligari, inquinari a gente tenebrarum, non est anathemandus ? FEL. dixit: Christus unde nos mundauit ? unde nos liberauit ? AUG. dixit:

and thus Mani says that they are not sent into the kingdom of God. For you assert this, that they are damned; but Mani says this, that they are not damned, but are placed as a guard over that race of darkness. AUGUSTINE said: About that portion I deal with you, which you say, being defiled, is purged: afterward, if it be necessary, about that which is fixed in his mass. Meanwhile, that which is purged was defiled. FELIX said: That which is defiled is also cleansed. AUGUSTINE said: Whoever, then, says that the nature of God and the substance of God and that which God is can be defiled, bound, polluted by the race of darkness — is he not to be anathematized? FELIX said: Whence did Christ cleanse us? Whence did He free us? AUGUSTINE said:

摩尼因此說，它們並未被送入神的國。因為你斷言這事，說它們被定了罪；但摩尼說這事，說它們並未被定罪，而是被安置為看守那黑暗族類的。奧古斯丁說：關於那一部分我與你論究，就是你所說被玷污後又被潔淨的那部分：以後若有必要，再論那被固定在他團塊中的部分。眼下，那被潔淨的曾是被玷污的。費利克斯說：那被玷污的，也被潔淨。奧古斯丁說：那麼，凡說神的本性、神的本體、以及神所是的那位，能被黑暗族類所玷污、捆綁、污穢的人——豈不該被咒詛嗎？費利克斯說：基督從何處潔淨了我們？從何處釋放了我們？奧古斯丁說：

22:116

Christus non partem dei, non naturam dei liberauit, sed facturam, quam fecit, in peccatum cadentem per liberum arbitrium sua misericordia liberauit. eam rem mundauit, quae pollui poterat, eam rem liberauit, quae captiuari poterat, eam rem sanauit, quae infirmari poterat. modo autem de deo, de natura dei, de substantia dei, de eo, quod deus est, loquimur . poterat pollui, an non poterat? FEL. dixit: Anima nostra ex deo est. quae polluta est? si non est ei deo, utquid pro illa Christus crucifixus est ? si ergo paret, quia Christus propter animam nostram crucifixus est, paret, quia ex deo est et polluta erat et ipse eam mundauit. AUG. dixit:

Christ freed not a portion of God, not the nature of God, but the creature which He made, falling into sin through free will — He freed it by His mercy. He cleansed that thing which could be defiled, He freed that thing which could be taken captive, He healed that thing which could be made infirm. But now we are speaking of God, of the nature of God, of the substance of God, of that which God is: could it be defiled, or could it not? FELIX said: Our soul is from God. Is it that which was defiled? If it is not from God, why was Christ crucified for it? If, therefore, it is evident that Christ was crucified for the sake of our soul, it is evident that it is from God and was defiled and He cleansed it. AUGUSTINE said:

基督所釋放的並非神的一部分，並非神的本性，而是祂所造、藉自由意志陷入罪中的受造物——祂憑祂的憐憫釋放了它。祂潔淨那能被玷污之物，祂釋放那能被擄之物，祂醫治那能變軟弱之物。但如今我們所論的是神、神的本性、神的本體、以及神所是的那位：它能被玷污，還是不能？費利克斯說：我們的靈魂是從神而出的。豈不是它被玷污了嗎？若它不是從神而出的，基督為何為它被釘十字架？因此，若顯明基督是為我們的靈魂被釘十字架，就顯明它是從神而出的、曾被玷污、並且祂潔淨了它。奧古斯丁說：

22:117

Ego non solum animam, sed et corpus nostrum et omnem creaturam et spiritalem et corporalem ex deo dico esse, quia hoc habet catholica fides. sed aliud est, quod de se deus genuit, quod hoc est, quod ipse; aliud autem, quod fecit deus. quod deus genuit, aequale est patri; quod deus fecit. non est aequale conditum conditori. aliud autem dicimus ex deo esse, quod melius dicitur de deo esse, quia hoc est, quod ipse, sicut unigenitus filius, sicut uerbum eius, per quod facta sunt omnia: alia uero sic dicimus ex deo, quia dixit, et facta sunt; mandauit, et constituta sunt\'. hinc est anima, ex his, quae fecit deus, non illud, quod de se genuit deus.

I say that not only the soul, but also our body and every creature, both spiritual and corporeal, is from God, because this the catholic faith holds. But one thing is what God begot of Himself, which is that which He Himself is; another thing is what God made. What God begot is equal to the Father; what God made — the thing created is not equal to the Creator. But we say that one thing is from God in such a way that it is better said to be of God, because it is that which He Himself is, as the only-begotten Son, as His Word, through whom all things were made; while other things we say to be from God in this way, because 'He spoke, and they were made; He commanded, and they were created.' Hence is the soul, from among the things which God made, not that which God begot of Himself.

我說，不但靈魂，連我們的身體、以及一切受造物，無論屬靈的還是屬物質的，都是從神而出的，因為大公信仰持守這一點。但神從自己所生的是一回事，那就是祂自己所是的；神所造的又是另一回事。神所生的與父同等；神所造的——受造之物與創造者並不同等。但我們說，有一種東西是從神而出，以致更該說是「屬神的」，因為它就是祂自己所是的，如那獨生子，如祂的道，萬物是藉祂而造的；而另一種東西我們如此說是從神而出，因為「祂說有，就有；命立，就立。」靈魂即由此而來，屬於神所造之物，而非神從自己所生之物。

22:118

ideo uerbum, quod de se genuit, pollui non potuit nec potest nec poterit. anima uero, quam fecit rectricem corporis, ut seruiret superiori, dominaretur inferiori, id est seruiret deo,^ dominaretur corpori, contempta dei lege per peccatum polluta est; deus autem misericordiam praestans his, quae fecit, misit filium, per quem fecit, et per illum refecit. quando condendum erat, quod non erat, per uerbum conditum est; quando reficiendum erat, quod deprauatum factum fuerat, suscepta est inde creatura de uirgine Maria, ut per id, quod erat homo, demonstraretur homini, et quid sustinendum et quid sperandum esset.

Therefore the Word, which He begot of Himself, could not, cannot, and will not be able to be defiled. But the soul, which He made as ruler of the body, that it should serve the higher and rule the lower — that is, serve God and rule the body — having despised the law of God, was defiled through sin. But God, showing mercy to the things He made, sent His Son, through whom He made them, and through Him remade them. When that which was not had to be created, it was created through the Word; when that which had been made and corrupted had to be remade, a creature was taken up from thence from the Virgin Mary, so that through that which was man, it might be shown to man both what must be endured and what must be hoped for.

因此，祂從自己所生的道，過去不能、現在不能、將來也不能被玷污。但靈魂，祂造它作身體的統治者，使它服事在上的、管轄在下的——就是服事神、管轄身體——它藐視了神的律法，便藉罪被玷污了。然而神向祂所造之物施憐憫，差來祂的兒子，就是祂藉以造萬物的，並藉祂重造了它們。當那本不存在的須被創造時，它是藉道被造的；當那已被造、又被敗壞的須被重造時，一個受造物便由此從童貞女馬利亞被取來，好叫藉著那作為人的，向人顯明何當忍受、何當盼望。

22:119

itaque natura uerbi, substantia unigeniti filii dei nihil passa est uel a persecutoribus Iudaeis uel a diabolo angelo malo persequente. sed quia induit se carne, induit se re mortali, re passibili, re mutabili: in eo quod se induit, passus est quicquid uoluit ad exemplum patientiae, et reformauit hoc ad exemplum iustitiae. tu modo dic mihi de dei parte, quod deus est, utrum pollui possit, an non. si potest, non est incommutabilis deus, et qui hoc dicit, anathemandus est . si autem non potest, uides anathemandum Manichaeum esse, qui dicit partem dei, naturam dei, id quod est deus, uenisse huc puram ad gentem tenebrarum ligatam atque pollutam, ut indigeat solui et mundari. FEL. dixit:

And so the nature of the Word, the substance of the only-begotten Son of God, suffered nothing either from the persecuting Jews or from the devil, the evil angel who persecuted Him. But because He clothed Himself with flesh, He clothed Himself with a mortal thing, a passible thing, a mutable thing: in that which He put on, He suffered whatever He willed, as an example of patience, and reformed this as an example of righteousness. Now do you tell me concerning the portion of God, that which God is, whether it can be defiled, or not. If it can, God is not immutable, and whoever says this is to be anathematized. But if it cannot, you see that Mani is to be anathematized, who says that a portion of God, the nature of God, that which is God, came here pure to the race of darkness, bound and defiled, so as to need to be loosed and cleansed. FELIX said:

如此，道的本性、神獨生子的本體，無論從逼迫祂的猶太人，還是從那逼迫祂的惡天使魔鬼，都未受任何苦。但因祂用肉身披上自己，就披上了一個必死之物、可受苦之物、可變之物：在祂所披上的那物中，祂隨己意受了一切苦，作為忍耐的榜樣，又把這改造為公義的榜樣。如今你告訴我，關於神的那一部分、就是神所是的，它能被玷污，還是不能。若能，神就不是不變的，凡說這話的人都該被咒詛。但若不能，你就看見摩尼該被咒詛，因他說神的一部分、神的本性、就是神所是的，純潔地來到這裡、來到黑暗族類中，被捆綁、被玷污，以致需要被鬆開、被潔淨。費利克斯說：

22:120

Hoc tu dixisti de anima, quia ex deo non est? AUG. dixit: Non dixi; sed dixi, quia ex deo est, tamquam a deo facta, non tamquam de deo nata. FEL. dixit: Dixisti de anima, quia non est ex deo, sed factura dei, quia sine deo nihil est; hoc enim dicis tu et non uis adseuerare, quia ex deo est anima. AUG. dixit: A deo est, sed facta a deo. FEL. dixit: Aut facta aut missa aut data, ex deo est. ergo si ex deo est et polluta est et uenit Christus liberare eam de pollutione, quid culpas Manichaeum ? AUG. dixit: Quia ego dico animam non naturam dei, sed factam a deo per liberum arbitrium peccasse et peccato esse pollutam et per dei misericordiam in paenitentia liberatam; tu autem ipsam naturam dei.

Did you say this about the soul, that it is not from God? AUGUSTINE said: I did not say it; but I said that it is from God, as made by God, not as born of God. FELIX said: You said about the soul that it is not from God, but a creature of God, since without God it is nothing; for this you say and are unwilling to affirm that the soul is from God. AUGUSTINE said: It is from God, but made by God. FELIX said: Whether made or sent or given, it is from God. Therefore, if it is from God and was defiled, and Christ came to free it from defilement, why do you blame Mani? AUGUSTINE said: Because I say that the soul is not the nature of God, but made by God, and that it sinned through free will and was defiled by sin and through God's mercy was freed in penitence; but you say that it is the very nature of God…

你是這樣說靈魂的嗎，說它不是從神而出的？奧古斯丁說：我沒有這樣說；我說的是它從神而出，是被神所造，而非從神所生。費利克斯說：你論靈魂說它不是從神而出，而是神的受造物，因為沒有神它便是無有；你說的正是這個，卻不肯斷言靈魂是從神而出的。奧古斯丁說：它是從神而來的，但是被神所造的。費利克斯說：無論是被造、被差、還是被賜，它都是從神而出的。因此，若它是從神而出、又被玷污，基督又來釋放它脫離玷污，你為何責備摩尼？奧古斯丁說：因為我說靈魂不是神的本性，而是被神所造，並藉自由意志犯了罪、被罪玷污，又藉神的憐憫在悔改中得釋放；而你卻說它就是神的本性……

22:121

quod deus est, deum de deo dicis in gente tenebrarum captum atque pollutum . et multum interest inter id, quod de se deus genuit et quod fecit non de se, sed ex nihilo, id est cum omnino non esset, a deo accepit, ut esset, id est ut institueretur. FEL dixit: Ergo pars dei est. AUG. dixit: Iam tibi dictum est, non est pars dei; et accipe, quomodo intellegas deum omnipotentem factorem. omnia, quae fiunt et quod quisque facit, aut de se est aut ex aliquo aut ei nihilo. homo quia non est omnipotens, de se filium facit, ex aliquo, sicut artifex ex ligno arcam, ex argento uasculum. potuit enim facere uasculum, sed non potuit facere argentum; potuit facere arcam, sed non potuit facere lignum.

— that which God is; you say that God-from-God was captured and defiled in the race of darkness. And there is a great difference between that which God begot of Himself and that which He made not of Himself, but out of nothing — that is, when it was not at all, it received from God that it should be, that is, that it should be established. FELIX said: Therefore it is a portion of God. AUGUSTINE said: It has already been told you: it is not a portion of God; and receive how you may understand God the omnipotent maker. All things that are made, and whatever anyone makes, are either of himself, or out of something, or out of nothing. Man, because he is not omnipotent, makes a son of himself, and makes out of something — as the craftsman a chest out of wood, a little vessel out of silver. For he could make the vessel, but he could not make the silver; he could make the chest, but he could not make the wood.

——就是神所是的；你說「出於神的神」在黑暗族類中被擄獲、被玷污。神從自己所生的、與祂所造的（不是出於自己，而是出於無有——就是它全然不存在時，從神領受了「存在」，也就是被設立）二者之間，有極大的分別。費利克斯說：那麼它就是神的一部分。奧古斯丁說：已經對你說過了：它不是神的一部分；且領受你當如何理解那全能的創造者神。凡被造之物、凡任何人所造的，或是出於自己，或是出於某物，或是出於無有。人因不是全能的，就從自己生子，又出於某物而造——如工匠用木頭造箱、用銀子造小器皿。因為他能造那器皿，卻不能造銀子；他能造那箱子，卻不能造木頭。

22:122

ex nihilo autem, ex eo, quod prorsus non est, facere ut sit, nullus hominum potest. deus autem quia omnipotens est, et de se filium genuit et ex nihilo mundum fecit et ex limo hominem formauit, ut per istas tres potentias ostenderet effectionem suam in omnibus ualentem. quia de se quod fecit, nec fecisse dicendus est, sed genuisse. quod autem ex aliquo, sicut de terra hominem, non sic fecit hominem de terra, ut alius ei fecerit ipsam terram, unde faceret hominem. quomodo fecit deus argentum argentario, unde faciat uasculum; sed ipse fecit et, quod non erat, ut esset, et quod inde rursus esset, quod iam ipse ex nihilo creauerat, ut esset.

But out of nothing — out of that which utterly is not — to make something be, no man can. But God, because He is omnipotent, both begot a Son of Himself, and made the world out of nothing, and formed man out of the clay, so that through these three powers He might show His efficacy prevailing over all things. For what He made of Himself is not to be said to have been made, but begotten. But what He made out of something — as man out of earth — He did not make man out of earth in such a way that another had made for Him the earth itself out of which He might make man, as God made silver for the silversmith out of which to make a little vessel; rather He Himself made both that which was not, that it should be, and that which should thence exist, which He had already Himself created out of nothing, that it should be.

但出於無有——出於那全然不存在之物——使某物存在，這是無人能做的。然而神，因祂是全能的，既從自己生了子，又出於無有造了世界，又用泥造了人，好叫祂藉這三種能力顯明祂的效能在萬物上得勝。因為祂出於自己所作的，不當說是「造」，而當說是「生」。至於祂出於某物所作的——如出於地造人——祂造人出於地，並非像是另有一位為祂造了那地本身、使祂可用來造人，如神為銀匠造了銀子、供他造小器皿一般；倒是祂自己既造了那本不存在的、使它存在，又造了那由此而出之物，就是祂自己早已從無有所造、使之存在的。

22:123

sic ergo corpus, sic anima, sic intellegitur uniuersa creatura facta a deo, non genita de deo, ut hoc sit, quod deus. proinde modo forte eliges, quid teneas et quid respuas. elige, quid sit melius. quoniam uidemus multa mutabilia et ipsa tamen bona quamuis mutabilia, multa mortalia et ipsa tamen bona quamuis mortalia, bonum autem incommutabile omnino ipse deus est, quid melius sit tibi tenere elige: deum mutabilem esse, an quod deus fecit esse mutabile, quia necesse est, ut unum de duobus dicas. si nolueris admittere id, quod fecit deus, esse mutabile, restat, ut dicas ipsum deum esse mutabilem. ut .

Thus, then, is the body, thus the soul, thus is understood the whole creation to be made by God, not begotten of God, so as to be that which God is. Accordingly, now perhaps you will choose what to hold and what to reject. Choose what is better. Since we see many mutable things, and yet these good although mutable, many mortal things, and yet these good although mortal, but the unchangeable good is altogether God Himself — choose which it is better for you to hold: that God is mutable, or that what God made is mutable; for it is necessary that you say one of the two. If you will not admit that what God made is mutable, it remains that you say that God Himself is mutable.

如此，身體是這樣，靈魂是這樣，整個受造界都當如此被理解為由神所造，而非從神所生，以致成為神所是的。因此，如今你或許要選擇持守什麼、棄絕什麼。選那更好的吧。既然我們看見許多可變之物，卻仍是善的、儘管可變，許多必死之物，卻仍是善的、儘管必死，而那不變的善全然就是神自己——那麼你就選擇，於你更好的是持守哪一項：神是可變的，還是神所造的是可變的；因為你必須在二者中說一項。你若不肯承認神所造的是可變的，就只剩下你說神自己是可變的了。

22:124

autem ab hoc sacrilegio te purges et ab hac blasphemia, ne dicas substantiam dei esse mutabilem, quare non concedis deum, qui uere est et incommutabilis est, quia ipse etiam dixit: ego sum qui sum, fecisse omnia bona, sed non sibi paria? proinde quia incommutabilis ipse est, non est mirum, si quod fecit, quia ei aequale non est, non est incommutabile, sed mutabile. ideo et per liberum arbitrium peccare et pollui potuit et per eius misericordiam liberari. FEL. dixit: Dixisti hominem fecisse sibi filium; nihil. interest inter patrem et filium. quia hoc ergo protulit sanctitas tua, et ego respondeo, quia deus et quae facit aequalia sunt sibi. AUG. dixit:

But that you may purge yourself of this sacrilege and of this blasphemy, lest you say that the substance of God is mutable, why do you not grant that God, who truly is and is unchangeable — since He Himself also said, 'I am who I am' — made all things good, but not equal to Himself? Accordingly, since He Himself is unchangeable, it is no wonder if what He made, because it is not equal to Him, is not unchangeable, but mutable. Therefore also through free will it could sin and be defiled, and through His mercy be freed. FELIX said: You said that a man makes a son for himself; there is no difference between father and son. Since, therefore, your Holiness has put this forward, I too answer, that God and the things He makes are equal to Him. AUGUSTINE said:

但為叫你洗淨自己脫離這褻瀆與這謗讟，免得你說神的本體是可變的，你為何不承認：那真正存在、不變的神——既然祂自己也說了「我是自有永有的」——造了萬物都是好的，卻不與祂自己同等呢？因此，既然祂自己是不變的，那麼祂所造的，因不與祂同等，而不是不變的、乃是可變的，這就不足為奇。所以它也能藉自由意志犯罪、被玷污，並藉祂的憐憫得釋放。費利克斯說：你說人為自己生子；父與子之間並無分別。既然你的聖德提出了這一點，我也回答：神與祂所造的，都與祂同等。奧古斯丁說：

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Quod intellegere noluisti, quia homo, cum filium facit, non facere proprie dicitur, sed proprie generare dicitur, sic et deus unicum filium genuit\' dixi tibi, non fecit. fecit autem illud, quod aequale ei non est; quod autem genuit, aequale illi est. itaque elige tibi, utrum uelis dicere mutabilem dei facturam, an mutabilem dei naturam. FEL. dixit: Quomodo deus inmutabilis est, similiter, quem genuit, inmutabilis est, et quod fecit, si de ipsius natura est, non mutatur. AUG. dixit: Sed iam tibi dictum est, quia quod fecit, non de ipsius natura est, sed ex nihilo fecit, quia omnipotens est. non erat, et fecit, non de se, non de aliqua re, quam ipse non fecerat, sed ex nihilo. FEL. dixit:

What you were unwilling to understand — that a man, when he makes a son, is not properly said to make, but properly said to generate — so also God begot the only Son; I told you, He did not make him. But He made that which is not equal to Him; whereas what He begot is equal to Him. Therefore choose for yourself which you would rather say: that the creature of God is mutable, or that the nature of God is mutable. FELIX said: As God is immutable, likewise He whom He begot is immutable; and what He made, if it is of His own nature, is not changed. AUGUSTINE said: But it has already been told you that what He made is not of His own nature, but He made it out of nothing, because He is omnipotent. It was not, and He made it — not of Himself, not of any thing which He Himself had not made, but out of nothing. FELIX said:

你先前不肯理解的——即人在生子時，不當本義地說是「造」，而當本義地說是「生」——照樣，神生了那獨生子；我告訴過你，祂不是造他。但祂造了那不與祂同等的；至於祂所生的，卻與祂同等。因此你為自己選擇，你寧願說哪一項：神的受造物是可變的，還是神的本性是可變的。費利克斯說：正如神是不變的，照樣祂所生的也是不變的；而祂所造的，若是出於祂自己的本性，就不改變。奧古斯丁說：但已經對你說過了：祂所造的不是出於祂自己的本性，而是祂出於無有而造，因祂是全能的。它本不存在，祂就造了它，不是出於自己，不是出於任何祂自己未曾造的東西，而是出於無有。費利克斯說：

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Ego non hoc dixi, sed dixi: quia deus inmutabilis est, et quod genuit inmutabile est, et quod fecit inmutabile est. non dixi, unde illud fecit; non hoc quaesiui, unde fecerit. AUG. dixit: Sed a me audisti, quod non quaesisti, ut iam desineres stulta loqui. omnipotens deus et de se potuit generare et de nihilo facere et ex eo, quod iam fecerat, aliquid formare: de se filium aequalem sibi; de nihilo mundum et uniuersam creaturam; ex aliquo de terra hominem, quia omnipotens est. quod ergo de se ipso est, pollui numquam potest quomodo ipse;

I did not say this, but I said: since God is immutable, both that which He begot is immutable, and that which He made is immutable. I did not say out of what He made it; I did not ask this, out of what He may have made it. AUGUSTINE said: But you heard from me what you did not ask, so that you might now cease to speak foolishly. The omnipotent God was able both to generate of Himself, and to make out of nothing, and to form something out of that which He had already made: of Himself a Son equal to Himself; out of nothing the world and the whole creation; out of something, man from earth, because He is omnipotent. That, therefore, which is of Himself can never be defiled, just as He Himself;

我沒有這樣說，我說的是：既然神是不變的，那麼祂所生的也是不變的，祂所造的也是不變的。我沒有說祂出於什麼造它；我沒有問這個，就是祂可能出於什麼造它。奧古斯丁說：但你從我這裡聽見了你未曾問的，好叫你如今可以停止說愚昧話。全能的神既能從自己生，又能出於無有造，又能出於祂已造之物塑成某物：從自己生一位與自己同等的子；出於無有造世界與整個受造界；出於某物，用地造人，因祂是全能的。因此，那出於祂自己的，永不能被玷污，正如祂自己一樣；

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quod autem ab illo factum est, non de illo, et pollui potest per liberum arbitrium et mundari per ipsius misericordiam condemnando, quod peccauit, et agnoscendo, qui eum creauit. tu uero, qui paulo ante dixisti, quia qui dei partem corruptibilem et contaminabilem dicit, anathemandus est, negare autem non potes Manichaeum dixisse, quod pars dei in gente tenebrarum conprehensa atque polluta est, et his eum uerbis blasphemasse adparet. ita ut peius blasphemare forte non posset, aut anathema illum talia dicentem, aut tu cum illo anathemandus es et abiciendus. FEL. dixit: Manichaeus dicit, quia polluta est pars dei; et Christus dicit. quia polluta est anima, et uenit liberare illam de pollutione.

But that which was made by him, and not out of him, can both be defiled through free will and be cleansed through his mercy—by condemning that which has sinned and acknowledging him who created it. You, however, who said a little earlier that whoever calls a part of God corruptible and defilable must be anathematized, cannot deny that Mani said that a part of God was seized and defiled among the race of darkness; and it is plain that by these words he blasphemed—so gravely, indeed, that he could perhaps not have blasphemed worse. Either anathematize him for saying such things, or you must be anathematized and cast out together with him. FELIX said: Mani says that a part of God has been defiled; and Christ says that the soul has been defiled, and that he came to set it free from defilement.

但那由祂所造、卻非出於祂本體的，既能藉自由意志被玷污，也能藉祂的憐憫得潔淨——就是譴責那犯了罪的，並承認那創造它的。可是你，方才既說凡稱神有可朽壞、可玷污之部分者當被咒詛，你就不能否認摩尼曾說神的一部分在黑暗族類中被擄獲並被玷污；由這些話顯然可見他是褻瀆了神——其嚴重程度，或許再無更甚的褻瀆了。你若非咒詛他說這等話，就當與他一同被咒詛、被棄絕。斐理斯說：摩尼說神的一部分被玷污了；而基督說靈魂被玷污了，並且祂來要救它脫離玷污。

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AUG. dixit: Sed anima non est pars dei. nam tu iam confessus es, quia Manichaeus dixit pollutam partem dei; nos autem pollutam dicimus animam ex uoluntate peccati; non esse autem animam partem dei, non de deo genitam, sed a deo factam. sic ergo dicitur anima ex deo, quomodo dicitur aliquod opus fabri ex artificio eius uel ex ipso factum, non tamen de ipso genitum. sicut filius eius. tu ergo quia iam confessus es Manichaeum dixisse pollui partem dei et iamdudum dixisti anathemandum, qui dicit corruptibilem uel contaminabilem deum uel naturam eius, iam anathemasti, quod non uis fateri. hoc enim, quod dixisti.

AUGUSTINE said: But the soul is not a part of God. For you have now already confessed that Mani said a part of God was defiled; we, however, say that the soul is defiled by the will to sin, and that the soul is not a part of God, not begotten of God, but made by God. Thus, then, the soul is said to be 'from God' in the way that some work of a craftsman is said to be from his skill, or made by him, yet not begotten out of him, as is his son. Since therefore you have already confessed that Mani said a part of God is defiled, and you said long ago that whoever calls God, or his nature, corruptible or defilable must be anathematized, you have already pronounced the anathema that you are unwilling to admit. For this, which you said—

奧古斯丁說：可是靈魂並非神的一部分。因為你如今已承認摩尼說神的一部分被玷污了；而我們則說，靈魂是因犯罪的意志而被玷污，靈魂並非神的一部分，並非由神所生，乃是神所造。故此，說靈魂「出於神」，正如說工匠的某件作品出於他的技藝、或由他所造，卻非由他本體所生，不像他的兒子那樣。因此，你既已承認摩尼說神的一部分被玷污，且早先又說凡稱神或神的本性為可朽壞、可玷污者當被咒詛，你便已作出你所不願承認的咒詛了。因為你所說的話——

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quia polluitur et quia mundatur, hoc ipso, quod dicis "mundatur," expressisti, quia polluitur, et non habes, unde euadas. et Manichaeus et tu dixisti. quia polluitur pars dei. anathema ergo Manichaeum aut anathemandus es cum Manichaeo. FEL. dixit: Ego non a Manichaeo didici, quia polluta est pars dei, sed a Christo didici. quia propter animam uenit, quae polluta erat.. AUG. dixit: A Christo non didicisti, quia anima pars dei est. FEL. dixit: A Christo didici, quia anima ex deo est. AUG. dixit: Et nos didicimus, quia anima ex deo est, sed non" est pars dei." sic est enim anima ex deo, quomodo factura ex artifice, non de deo, sicut filius de patre. FEL. dixit: De pollutione agimus .

—namely that it is defiled and that it is cleansed—by this very saying, 'it is cleansed,' you have expressed that it is defiled, and you have no way of escape. Both Mani and you have said that a part of God is defiled. Anathematize Mani, then, or you must be anathematized along with Mani. FELIX said: I did not learn from Mani that a part of God is defiled, but I learned from Christ that he came on account of the soul, which had been defiled. AUGUSTINE said: You did not learn from Christ that the soul is a part of God. FELIX said: I learned from Christ that the soul is from God. AUGUSTINE said: We too have learned that the soul is from God, but that it is not 'a part of God.' For the soul is from God in the way that a thing made is from its maker, not out of God as the Son is out of the Father. FELIX said: We are dealing with defilement.

——就是說它被玷污、又被潔淨——單憑你說「被潔淨」這句話，你就已表明它是被玷污了，你再無可逃避之處。摩尼和你都說神的一部分被玷污了。那麼你要咒詛摩尼，否則你就當與摩尼一同被咒詛。斐理斯說：我並非從摩尼學得神的一部分被玷污，乃是從基督學得祂為靈魂而來，因靈魂曾被玷污。奧古斯丁說：你並未從基督學得靈魂是神的一部分。斐理斯說：我從基督學得靈魂出於神。奧古斯丁說：我們也學得靈魂出於神，但並非「神的一部分」。因為靈魂出於神，正如受造之物出於其造作者，並非如聖子出於聖父那樣由神本體而出。斐理斯說：我們現在談的是玷污的問題。

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si polluta est anima, quae ex deo est, et potest purgari a Christo, qui pro illa uenit, et illa pars dei, quam Manichaeus dicit, pollui potest et mundari per mandatum ipsius dei. AUG. dixit: Ecce iterum dicis partem dei pollutam purgari et paulo ante dixeras anathemandum esse, qui illam dicit corruptibilem; modo dicis, quia pollui potuit, et dicis, quia mundari potest. ut confirmes, quia pollui potuit. hoc nos de parte dei non dicimus, sed de anima dicimus, quae tamquam opus eius ex ipso est, non tamquam proles de ipso. redi ergo ad id, quod dicis, et discerne, quod dicimus: anima nec deus est nec pars dei.

If the soul, which is from God, has been defiled, and can be purified by Christ, who came for its sake, then that part of God too, of which Mani speaks, can be defiled and cleansed through the command of God himself. AUGUSTINE said: See, again you say that a defiled part of God is purified, and a little before you had said that whoever calls it corruptible must be anathematized; now you say that it could be defiled, and you say that it can be cleansed—so as to confirm that it could be defiled. This we do not say of a part of God, but we say it of the soul, which is from him as his work, not as offspring out of him. Go back, then, to what you say, and distinguish what we say: the soul is neither God nor a part of God.

倘若那出於神的靈魂被玷污了，又能被那為它而來的基督潔淨，那麼摩尼所說的神的那一部分，也能被玷污、又能藉神自己的命令得潔淨。奧古斯丁說：看哪，你又說神那被玷污的部分得了潔淨，可你方才卻說凡稱它為可朽壞者當被咒詛；如今你卻說它可能被玷污，並說它能被潔淨——藉此坐實它確曾可被玷污。這話我們並不用在神的部分上，卻用在靈魂上，因靈魂如同祂的作品而出於祂，並非如由祂本體而生的後裔。那麼回到你所說的話上來，並要分清我們所說的：靈魂既非神，也非神的一部分。

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tu autem Manichaeum dicis dixisse pollui partem dei, quam dicit purgari, ut confirmet, quia polluitur. restat ergo, ut eum anathemes aut ista sentiens anathemeris. PEL. dixit: Pertinet ad deum anima, quae per peccatum coinquinata est, an non ? AUG. dixit: Pertinet, sed non est pars eius. FEL. dixit: Non hoc interrogaui. AUG. dixit: Et quid interrogasti ? FEL. dixit: Pertinet ad deum, an non pertinet? AUG. dixit: Iam dixi, et quia pertinet et quomodo pertineat. FEL. dixit: Ego quaero, utrum est ex deo. AUG. dixit: Ex deo, non de deo. FEL. dixit:

But you say that Mani said a part of God is defiled, which he says is purified, so as to confirm that it is defiled. It remains, therefore, that you either anathematize him, or be anathematized yourself for holding these things. FELIX said: Does the soul, which has been polluted through sin, belong to God, or not? AUGUSTINE said: It belongs to him, but it is not a part of him. FELIX said: That is not what I asked. AUGUSTINE said: And what did you ask? FELIX said: Does it belong to God, or does it not belong? AUGUSTINE said: I have already said both that it belongs and in what manner it belongs. FELIX said: I ask whether it is from God. AUGUSTINE said: From God, but not out of God. FELIX said:

但你說摩尼曾說神的一部分被玷污，又說那部分得了潔淨，藉此坐實它是被玷污的。因此結論是：你若非咒詛他，就當自己因持守這些話而被咒詛。斐理斯說：那因罪而被污穢的靈魂，究竟屬乎神，還是不屬乎神？奧古斯丁說：它屬乎祂，但並非祂的一部分。斐理斯說：我問的不是這個。奧古斯丁說：那你問的是甚麼？斐理斯說：它屬乎神，還是不屬乎神？奧古斯丁說：我已經說了，它既屬乎祂，也說了它是如何屬乎祂。斐理斯說：我問的是它是否出於神。奧古斯丁說：出於神，但非由神本體而出。斐理斯說：

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Si nihil peccatum est, quia ex deo est et polluta est et uenit Christus liberare eam et eam liberauit a peccato, quid culpamus Manichaeum, qui dicit partem dei pollutam esse et iterum mundari? AUG. dixit: Quia iam confessus es Manichaeum dixisse partem dei esse pollutam et dicis non esse peccatum talem blasphemiam in deum effundere. nos autem dicimus quidem peccasse animam per liberum arbitrium et paenitendo purgari per misericordiam creatoris sui, quia non est ex deo tamquam pars eius uel tamquam proles eius, sed ex deo uel a deo facta est tamquam opus eius: quid intersit inter nostram fidem et uestram perfidiam, omnibus manifestum est.

If it is no sin, since the soul is from God and has been defiled, and Christ came to free it and did free it from sin, why do we blame Mani, who says that a part of God has been defiled and is cleansed again? AUGUSTINE said: Because you have now confessed that Mani said a part of God is defiled, and you say it is no sin to pour out such blasphemy against God. We, however, do indeed say that the soul sinned through free will and is purified by repentance through the mercy of its Creator, since it is not from God as a part of him or as his offspring, but was made from God, or by God, as his work. What difference there is between our faith and your faithlessness is manifest to all.

倘若這並非罪，既然靈魂出於神、且被玷污了，而基督又來救它、也確實救它脫離了罪，那麼我們為何責備摩尼呢？他說神的一部分被玷污、又再得潔淨。奧古斯丁說：因為你如今已承認摩尼說神的一部分被玷污，且你竟說向神傾吐這等褻瀆並非罪。而我們則確實說，靈魂是藉自由意志犯了罪，並藉懺悔、憑其造物主的憐憫得潔淨，因它並非如神的一部分或如祂的後裔那樣出於神，乃是如祂的作品那樣從神、或由神所造。我們的信仰與你們的邪妄之間有何分別，眾人都是顯而易見的。

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itaque secundum uerba tua superiora, quia concessisti anathemandum eum, qui dicit corruptibilem dei naturam — quod et Manichaeum et te dicere manifestum est — quia noluisti. ut esset a te anathematus, eris cum illo anathematus. Post haec cum multis uerbis inter se agerent, FEL. dixit: Dic iam, quid uis faciam ? + AUG. dixit: (Ut anathemes Manichaeum, cuius sunt tantae istae blasphemiae; sed si ex animo facis, tunc fac . nemo enim te cogit inuitum. FEL. dixit: Deus uidet, si ex animo facio; non enim homo potest uidere . sed hoc peto, ut confirmes me. AUG. dixit: In quo uis ut confirmem te? FEL. dixit: Prior tu anathema, ut et ego postea anathemem. AUG. dixit: Ecce manu mea etiam scribo;

And so, according to your own earlier words—since you granted that whoever calls the nature of God corruptible must be anathematized (which it is plain that both Mani and you say)—because you were unwilling to be the one to anathematize him, you will be anathematized together with him. After this, when they had argued much between themselves, FELIX said: Tell me now, what do you want me to do? AUGUSTINE said: That you anathematize Mani, whose are these so great blasphemies; but if you do it from the heart, then do it, for no one compels you against your will. FELIX said: God sees whether I do it from the heart, for no man can see it. But this I ask, that you strengthen me. AUGUSTINE said: In what do you wish me to strengthen you? FELIX said: You anathematize first, so that I too may anathematize afterward. AUGUSTINE said: See, I even write it with my own hand;

因此，按你自己先前的話——既然你承認凡稱神的本性為可朽壞者當被咒詛（顯然摩尼和你都這樣說）——因為你不肯作那咒詛他的人，你就必與他一同被咒詛。此後，他們彼此爭辯了許多話，斐理斯說：現在請告訴我，你要我作甚麼？奧古斯丁說：就是要你咒詛摩尼，這等重大的褻瀆都出於他；但你若出於真心去作，那就去作，因為沒有人強你所不願的。斐理斯說：我是否出於真心去作，惟有神看得見，因為沒有人能看見。但我只求你，願你堅固我。奧古斯丁說：你要我在甚麼事上堅固你？斐理斯說：你先咒詛，好叫我隨後也咒詛。奧古斯丁說：看哪，我甚至親手寫下；

22:134

uolo enim, ut et tu manu tua scribas. FEL. dixit: Sed sic anathema, ut spiritum ipsum, qui in Manichaeo fuit et per eum ista locutus est, anathemes. Augustinus accepta charta scripsit haec uerba: Augustinus ecclesiae catholicae episcopus iam anathemaui Manichaeum et doctrinam eius et spiritum, qui per eum tam execrabiles blasphemias locutus est, quia spiritus seductor erat non ueritatis, sed nefandi erroris; et nunc anathemo supra dictum Manichaeum et spiritum erroris ipsius. Et cum eandem chartam Felici dedisset, etiam ille manu sua haec uerba scripsit:

for I want you also to write with your own hand. FELIX said: But anathematize in such a way as also to anathematize that very spirit which was in Mani and spoke these things through him. Augustine, taking a sheet, wrote these words: I, Augustine, bishop of the Catholic Church, have already anathematized Mani and his doctrine and the spirit which through him spoke such execrable blasphemies, because it was a spirit that seduces—not the spirit of truth, but of impious error; and now I anathematize the aforesaid Mani and the spirit of his error. And when he had given the same sheet to Felix, he too wrote these words with his own hand:

因為我也要你親手書寫。斐理斯說：可是你要這樣咒詛，好叫你連同那在摩尼裡面、藉他說出這些話的靈也一併咒詛。奧古斯丁取過一張紙，寫下這些話：我奧古斯丁，大公教會的主教，已經咒詛摩尼並他的教義，並那藉他說出如此可憎褻瀆之言的靈，因為那是一個迷惑人的靈，並非真理之靈，乃是邪惡謬妄之靈；如今我咒詛上述的摩尼並他謬妄之靈。他把這同一張紙交給斐理斯後，斐理斯也親手寫下這些話：

22:135

ego Felix, qui Manichaeo credideram, nunc anathemo eum et doctrinam ipsius et spiritum seductorem, qui in illo fuit, qui dixit deum partem suam genti , tenebrarum miscuisse et eam tam turpiter liberare, ut uirtutes suas transfiguraret in feminas contra masculina et ipsas iterum in masculos contra feminea daemonia, ita ut postea reliquias ipsius suae partis configat in aeternum globo tenebrarum. has omnes et ceteras blasphemias Manichaei anathemo. Augustinus episcopus his in ecclesia coram populo gestis subscripsi. Felix his gestis subscripsi.

I, Felix, who had believed in Mani, now anathematize him and his doctrine and the seducing spirit that was in him—who said that God mingled a part of himself with the race of darkness and freed it in so shameful a manner, transforming his own powers (virtutes) into females against the male demons, and these again into males against the female demons, in such a way that afterward he fastens forever in the globe of darkness the remnants of that same part of his. All these and the other blasphemies of Mani I anathematize. I, bishop Augustine, have subscribed to these proceedings enacted in the church before the people. I, Felix, have subscribed to these proceedings.

我斐理斯，曾信從摩尼，如今咒詛他並他的教義，並那在他裡面迷惑人的靈——那靈說神將自己的一部分與黑暗族類混雜，又以如此可恥的方式解救它，把自己的諸德能變作女性以對付雄性魔鬼，又把她們再變作男性以對付雌性魔鬼，以致此後將自己那部分的殘餘永遠釘結於黑暗的球體中。摩尼這一切以及其餘的褻瀆，我都咒詛。我奧古斯丁主教，已在教會中當著眾人所行的此紀錄上署名。我斐理斯，已在此紀錄上署名。

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